I always google people I am about to have an interview with. This time, I was really impressed. His name goes hand by hand with biggest names of all times, like Nikola Tesla, Leonardo da Vinci, Elon Musk, Richard Branson… For many years he was almost underground, doing business person to person exclusively. “It is still the same,” he says, “I am present online only to show people that I am real. I have now my own website, but still don’t use Twitter, LinkedIn and other social media.” I talked with Roberto Hroval, founder and chairman of Hong Kong´s PatentReal Corporation.
Mr. Hroval, when we have published an article about your new biomass technology, it was a smash hit. I guess it is still the most viewed article on 24Seven News…
Oh, really? This is very nice to hear. Yes, we received a lot of inquiries for our Biomass Ultima plants. It is a new generation of using wood waste to make electricity, very efficiently.
But let’s start with a broader view. I spotted in the media a lot of projects your company is currently working on, like destress chamber Asclepius8, an implosion based flying saucer FCX-01, Biomass Ultima plant, Project Phoenix8 waste to energy technology, and even “food of the future”, X309. It is very unlikely that one company is working on such different projects at the same time…
Yes, it is unlikely indeed. But you have to know that we are not just a “waste to energy” nor even green energy company. Surely, we do all that, but much more. Our goal is to offer help to people and the planet wherever we have good answer to the problem. So we choose our project not according to specific industry, but whether we are able to offer a workable solution, and compatible with our long term goals.
These projects are all based on proven an extensive, real knowledge and working products. We don’t produce ideas to just talk or daydream about. You know, like “This could work someday, under the certain conditions.” We expose a project publicly only after when we do an extensive research and prove it to some degree.
So whatever you hear or read about on our website – these are already proven and workable solutions.
This is great to hear. Internet is full of ideas, but it is hard to know if they have any validity and potential…
Exactly. I always say: “Show me first, talk later.” If you have nothing to show me, work on it. Astonish me with a solution and we will talk about it. With this approach, more than 97% of people and their “inventions” never come back to me. You have to know that an idea is maybe 1% of the whole story. With patenting and basic presentation, you got few more per cents.
Much work is hidden in a making of practical “proof of concept.” There are certain phases you have to go through, like alpha and beta series, all kind of testing, getting feedback from the market… And when this stage is over and you are ready to launch, you have another kind of challenges: documentation, education, distribution, maintenance, working with people… That kind of stuff.
It is a tough battle and only the fittest survive. It is not unlikely that completing a project takes ten or more years. For smaller projects, it is usually about four years. First year you prepare the idea and a practical model. In the second year, you do the testing and preparation for the market. After that, you start promoting and selling. You need about one year to reach the break-even point, so in the fourth year you can expect first economic rewards.
But as I said, if you deal with larger projects that affect the industry globally, you need much more time and, of course, funds.
It is safe to say this is not a business for everyone?
Absolutely. It’s not easy, but it’s not impossible either. Like I said in the beginning, I have some natural abilities, so to speak. I don’t force things to happen. You need to play pull-push game, with having a sensible ear for the right timing. Sometimes you have to go all in. Other times, you need to pull back or even get out as quickly as possible.
Most importantly, you need to have a vision, perseverance, very hard skin and, if you want to be a serious player, a lot of money. We invested millions euros of our own money into the projects, not to mentioned the energy, but this is how the things work. When you are not well known, nobody wants to give you money or even listen to you. When you have a homerun project, everyone is knocking on your door, offering you money and all kinds of “support”. And I always say: “Great, but where were you when I needed you and asked you for a help?”
People want to play a safe bet. But in our business, there is no such thing. You have to work on a project to some extend and then you see if it will go through or not.
Regarding the projects you mentioned – these are the ones that survived, the proven stuff. We worked hard on each and every one of them and brought them to the existing stage by our own knowledge and financing. There are more that ten years of serious preparations and testings. We have all the metrics and calculations for further industrial and economic exploitation. And we re not in a hurry. I learned in my 28 business years that you can’t push the river. Sometimes you just have to wait until all the pieces fall together.
Would you say that you do so-called “edge science” projects?
Well, it could seem that way for an untrained eye, but for me the projects are mainstream. At least I see them that way. If they are not mainstream today, they will certainly be tomorrow.
It might look like some project is in “wanna be” or “this is not possible” stage, but in truth, they are all proved to work. Look, I am in that business since I was fifteen. I can say that my first bigger project – high class hi-fi equipment – was based on a lot of positive circumstances, maybe even luck. I didn’t know much about market, economy and such. But I did have a great feeling for quality and design, and I loved listening to the music. I combined all together into a lucrative business.
I became familiar with economic rules of the market, psychology, industry designed, production, mass thinking, and the like. My very next project, a product called Asby, was based solely on market research and it was solving a big problem in car industry.
Have you had maybe misjudged and rejected any project that later became a big hit?
No, not that I am aware of. Well, I have to be say this. Some projects I declined still have potential, but on a lesser extent. I simply can’t work on everything. Lately, I focus more on global projects, which means that I might pass some minor ones that have good potential on local market, for example.
People compare you with Tesla, Da Vinci, Musk… Do you feel like genius or some kind of wonderchild?
Not really. I believe every person has something valuable to offer to the world. Some in the family, other in their neighborhood, other ones on the workplace… I just had a great luck to recognize my abilities early. And also, that my abilities can help a lot of people, worldwide. But it all happened organically. I put one idea to work, moved to another one…
Success gave me wings to do more of the same, so I persisted. Somehow that became my obsession and I was hooked. It was a street-smart school, learning by doing and from my own mistakes.
Later, I decided to do big things and decided to contribute to the global structure in several critical areas. I like thinking about better, safer and healthier future, where people would live fully. I like to move the obstacles and pave the ways.
Your green energy projects, Biomass Ultima and Project Phoenix8, seem to be biggest projects at the moment. What is the core potential of the projects and what is the basic technology behind?
We talk about two completely different projects here. AGE Biomass Ultima is the cogeneration system for transforming wood waste into electricity and special organic carbon or charcoal.
It is very robust, built to last and easy-to-maintain plant, with the highest utilization rate in the market. Machinery performs on “closed loop” principle, which means it doesn’t have chimney nor wastes. So it is the electric generator, with a twist: instead of heat, we managed to produce high quality organic carbon.
The organic carbon is one of those strategic products that is highly in demand right now and it will be, by predictions, for the next 50 years, as well.
Biomass Ultima is going on by the plan already. We established a special group of experts that run the project completely, under its own brand AGE, and without my engagement. It is the first scientifically-productive plant in the heart of Europe that will also perform as a showroom or experimental unit for our European clients.
We estimate the project on EUR 700 million.
On the other hand, there is Project Phoenix8, or PP8. This is waste to energy technology, with utilization rate of more than 98%, which is highest in the market, as well. This plant transforms scraped plastic or waste tires into basic elements. You literally put a rubber or plastic on one side and get fuel, gas, carbon, water, metal… on the other side.
Working with lower temperatures doesn’t only mean safer process for the environment, but it is economically much more efficient. Besides, the whole process is totally green, with no emissions whatsoever.
With two of the most important products, black carbon and diesel fuel, you can make good profit. Our products are of high purity, with no need for additional processing, which saves money, as well.
I can say this technology is set to work for the next 50 years, with no major improvements needed. It exceeds all environmental standards and beyond. Also, you can’t improve efficiency of the process by much more. We are working on higher quality of diesel fuel for EURO7 combustion engines in the future, but that’s it.
The PP8 project is estimated at EUR 22 billion.
The PP8 project is also running completely separated from all other projects, led by its own group of highly referenced experts. I have to admit that I’m currently fully dedicated to this project. I often say that this is the very best project I’ve come across in my whole career and I will be fully dedicated to it, no matter what.
But yes, this project is completely separated from others. And I personally supervise it, so nothing is left to chance.
We are very excited about this technology. Is this so-called “free energy” machinery?
O my god, let me tell you about those free energy devices people promote over the internet. I know the industry very well and up to date I still didn’t find any workable one. Whenever you hear “it runs on nothing”, pack your bags and leave the room immediately.
So let me be very clear here. No, PP8 it is not a free energy device. It is a technology that degrades waste tires or plastic into basic elements. You need the energy to run it. Beside input material, you also need workers, and you have other costs, too.
On the other side, the machinery is fully automated, well balanced, optimized, and output products are clean and in high demand by the market.
People sometimes forget that we actually talk about two things: one is producing highly profitable products and another one is solving huge, worldwide waste pollution environmental problem.
Now it is the perfect time for this kind of solution and also there is a high demand in European and USA markets. The machinery and business model offer high utilization rate. It is very economically rewarding project and set to run for a long time.
Is it true that the PP8 project will be operated using smart contracts and blockchain technology?
Yes, we find that the blockchain and smart contracts are prominent and modern, up to date tools, especially suitable for long run projects and for those that are solving global problems. I think environmental projects can create better future by solving the humanity mistakes from the past.
Can you confirm that the PP8 project will be available to invest in by mass market, through digital currency eco-system? That is, the digital currency that represents the project will be listed on the “digital stock exchange”?
Yes, it is true. This is the modern way to let the small investors get a piece of profit that comes from the project. By getting the investors classic way, only big banks, financial institutions, big companies and very wealthy people could be able to invest.
But I always wanted to offer a piece of pie to my friends, family members, and all other “everyday people” that usually are not allowed to participate in such big projects directly.
Long story short, we took a decision to go public through digital organic system and no long ago gathered substantial funds to start the project. We are very grateful to our investors and we reward them abundantly. We prepared a substantial pay-back system for original investors, so they will be very happy. We are actually few steps ahead with that reward system, but we decided not to tell anybody about it. We want to surprise them positively. You know, under promise, overdeliver.
We are also very grateful that we didn’t go out last year, when digital currency market was in bear trend. Right now, digital currencies are waking up and future looks bright. Also, some general things in the digital currency industry cleared up in the meantime, so from now on is good time to enter the market. Not yet today, but in the near future. We are working day and night right now to finish the required digital system and list our digital currency to the digital exchange within few months.
(This is the first part of the interview. The second part is available here.)